Using your rationament, if you're high speed cruising, the current of air resulted will be sufficient for the water inside the radiator to cool, right? If the water gets cool enought if you go faster then ~33km/h (20mph) this means it doesn't go over 98°C, right? If the water doesn't go over 98°C then there is NO NEED for the radiator fan to start, which means that it is useless to disconnect the fan since is not used at high speeds because there is no need for it to work.

This is why i called your ideea dumb. And it still remains dumb.


The whatever organism you named might ask for manualy controlled fans so that in case of probe failure or emergency, the pilot can start the fans right away, as he sees that the water temperature has increased over the reasonable limit. It would be logic that the manual command for the fans should be used only in case of emergency, in the rest of the situations, the automaded fan control is doing the job.

I don't need to get into a race car to know why automated systems were developed. Try thinking rationally for a few moments. Demanding the pilot to watch the water gauge continuously during the race is dumb!

Since by your own admission you don't have experience in the situations I am referring to, thus you must obviously know better than I. I will bow to your all great knowledge and just keep being dumb.

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Dean

This is not the place to go sarcastic. Ever wondered why the computers were invented? It's a simple motive: to do the man's job. Ever wondered why there is always a manual command to override every important automated (computer controlled) process? It's another simple motive: in case of computer failure, the process can still continue, manually operated.

Unless you are able to sustain your afirmations with rational arguments, let's stop filling this topic with crap.

blind wrote:

This is not the place to go sarcastic. Ever wondered why the computers were invented? It's a simple motive: to do the man's job. Ever wondered why there is always a manual command to override every important automated (computer controlled) process? It's another simple motive: in case of computer failure, the process can still continue, manually operated.

Unless you are able to sustain your affirmations with rational arguments, let's stop filling this topic with crap.

I think I PM'd you this to prevent just this.

So I am going to go against my own suggestion of starting a new thread.

The purpose here is to explore options ideas and debate them. Just bashing me and saying I am dumb was first and foremost unnecessary. You could have easily debated the topic with out insulting me. I suggest you re-think your approach to thigns here. It is not a way to make friends.

The reason we go manual fans is that is is mandated by the sanctioning body. For a street car your setup is obviously better (the car manufacturers do it all the time). Did you make the assumption that I am building a street car? Before calling me dumb you may want to ask more questions about things like application or how about just asking why I am even thinking of this option. Also what if my way of doing it works for my situation / car / rule set? Am I so dumb then? The fact is that logic is not always the correct way do do it (sounds like Caption Kirk talking to Mr Spock LOL). I guess what I am telling you is that logic does not always apply. This is the hardest lesson I have had to learn when building track cars for people. The purpose for this is to "fix" the human factor. Most drivers, pit crew and crew chiefs are so jacked up that when the car is on grid they will forget to turn the fans on (because they are manual as mandated by the sanctioning body). My RPM based cooling fan idea takes the human factor out of overheating on grid and red flags and adheres to the rule set and yet still maintains the manual control of the fan that is mandated and that most drivers want. How is this dumb?

So in short you are absolutely correct with respect to the use of temp sensors but you are also completely wrong with respect to what I am doing and I don't like being called dumb due to your ignorance of what I am trying to accomplish and why.

My statement sands. An RPM based trigger would be useful.

Edit: Should be speed based trigger.



Last edited by Dean924s on Wed May 05, 2010 2:13 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Respectfully

Dean

Ignoring the flames, wouldnt a megajolt-controlled Fan NOT be counted as a *manual* fan anyway ?

Hmm... You start contradicting yourself.
here you say that the speed will trigger the fan:

Dean924s wrote:

My set up would be under 20 MPH it would trigger the cooling fan to come on

And in the previous post you say that rpm should trigger the fan

Dean924s wrote:

My statement sands. An RPM based trigger would be useful.

I'm officialy lost in the fog. Which one should trigger the track car's fan?

Dean, i said in all my posts that the "manually controlled fan" is a dumb ideea, not that you are dumb. Please don't put words in my mouth
I don't consider you being a dumb person, just the idea.

As i said before, a manual override for the fan command seems a good thing, so that you can turn the fan on if the coolant temperature probe fails; but turning the fan off above a certain speed limit doesn't make any sense. I haven't read the regulations of the organisation's names you quoted in previous posts, but i think that the rule demands you to have a button to start the fan manually, not to disconnect it above certain speed.

Could you show us the paragraph where the thing you sustain is described? I don't intend to be malicious, just need to read that and convince myself that the regulation says that way. Stuff usually have to make sense (unless you live in my country, where you're leaded by $%^@tards).

Cheers!

PS: brentp, we begg you, tell us some new stuff about mj2

Will have updates next week or two.

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Brent Picasso
Founder, Autosport Labs

The rules require manual control of the fan meaning that there is a manual on and off. I want the fan to come on under a set speed (not RPM my mistake) . The reason is that when you are called to grid for the start of the race or during a red flag or most importantly when pitting for tires fuel etc. The car will heat soak. Having the fan come on and stay on will help alleviate this problem and hopefully give you an advantage when you re enter the track/race. The thermostat will regulate the flow of the coolant so motor will not over cool. It will also keep the temp more constant eliminating spikes. Having the fan on will also push air through the engine compartment and it will remove heat from the exterior of the motor and the other non liquid cooled items under the hood. I have run into the situation many times that the driver will forget to turn the fan on and when they come into pit or are just sitting on grid the motor overheats. I have actually had heads damaged due to the motor getting to 300 deg before the driver realised what was going on as we run closed cooling systems to prevent water / coolant from getting on the track or in the pits. I have also found that with the fan running the thermostat regulates the coolant flow to a constant rate versus the swings in temp you can get when the fans are controlled by a thermostat as there is usually an upper limit when they are to turn on and a lower limit where they are to turn off. In racing conditions when the motor is stressed more and the oscillations can be greater and occur faster than a temperature controlled fan can keep up with resulting in temp spikes over 250 deg. I have seen 265-275 in one particular case. So put all this together and I (as a crew chief and motor builder) want the fans to come on in my car anytime the car is under 20 MPH. It is dumb as a stump simple solution that takes the human factor out of the equation and also eliminates the vacillations that occurs when a temperature controlled cooling fan is used.

Does this make some sense now?

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Dean

Dean

How is the speed signal transferred from your gearbox to your speedo, is it the old cable or a more modern digital system???

Ryan

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